Category Archives: Samoens

A refuge in the Alps

What is a refuge?

I used to call them “huts” but the term tends to confuse the uninitiated. In fact I’ve just done a quick web search and Wikipedia has a long article on the subject here the term “Refuge” is hardly mentioned. The problem with calling them Mountain Huts is this really doesn’t do them justice. Many of them are extremely well appointed with small dorms or bedrooms, inside toilets and 3 course meals served every evening. The latest ones do have hot showers too but unless they are heated via the local hot spring I won’t be using them (please see Eco Living? below).

Sleeping arrangements at the Vogealle

Where do I sleep?

The traditional refuges have communal dorms, long sleeping platforms provided with pillows and blankets. The major downside with these is people that snore. You would be well advised to take some ear-plugs! Refuges that have been renovated in the last few years will probably have bedrooms that sleep 6/8 people. These are ideal for most groups and families and reduce the noise considerably. These more modern places may have duvets instead of blankets too. Either way, you will need to use a sheet sleeping bag.

Sometimes more closely related to a high mountain hotel!

What to take?

Refuges are not hotels, but then again they are not bothies either. So what should you take? Beyond your “normal” day kit for the mountains you probably only need to take a sheet sleeping bag, either to protect the duvets and reduce the requirement for laundering or to make the itchy blankets a little more comfortable. I usually take a fresh t-shirt, socks and underwear for the evening and don’t forget most of them are at quite an altitude so the evening might be quite chilly. A torch can be essential, especially if the toilets are outside. But whatever you do, try and travel light, the less you have to carry the more you will enjoy the walk!

Bouquetin near the Refuge Presset

Which refuge?

I live in the Haute Savoie so my recommendations are based on this. In the Massif du Mont-Blanc alone there are 50 to choose from, there is loads of information on the web and a book that covers them all too. I’ll cover a few here:

The following have shortish walks so would suit families.

Refuge de Loriaz, Chamonix, old style
http://www.refuges.info/point/370/refuge-garde/aiguilles-rouges/refuge-de-loriaz/
2 hrs of walking, 680m of climbing (from the valley) or start from the dam at Emosson, same time but much easier walk.

Refuge Tinderets, near Chatel, old style
http://www.refuge-abondance.com/
1 hr, 295m, very basic, very lovely

Refuge Folly, Samoens, old style but with small dorms and fresh food.
http://refuge-du-folly.perso.neuf.fr
2hr15min, 561m, lovely spot, donkeys for the kids to play with too. These guys are running an old refuge but with excellent eco-credentials. Have a look at the “Ecologie” page on their website.

Refuge de Varan, Passy (nr Chamonix)
http://www.varan.tourdesfiz.com/
1hr45min and 520m, amazing views of Mt Blanc.

Walk to Refuge Presset

These two are a little farther to walk, maybe best left to the more experienced.

Refuge de la Vogealle, 1902m, Samoens, recently renovated
http://www.refugedelavogealle.com/acces.html
3hrs15min, 950m of ascent, a really smart refuge in a great location.

Refuge de Presset, 2514m, near Beaufort (Savoie), brand new
http://refugedepresset.ffcam.fr/
A CAF (Club Alpin Francais) refuge, discounts for members. Various routes 800m of climbing, about 3hrs.

Monta Rosa Refuge 2,795m sleeps 120 near Zermatt

Eco Living?

Placing a building that can accommodate up to 100 people high in the mountains will have an obvious impact on the environment. The most extreme example is the new Refuge du Gouter, at 3,835m altitude on Mt Blanc, it accommodates 120 climbers each night. There is no running water so most of it is collected as snow and melted. Although the building is covered is solar panels the energy uses by this number of people is enormous. The very latest technology is being used to mitigate the impact but the people using the facilities need to be educated too and foregoing a hot shower for one night will go a long way! The other step forward the modern refuges have made is how they deal with the toilet facilities. Nowadays they have managed to bring the toilets inside the buildings and make them water free. A huge advance on the old system which I won’t be describing here.

Books and games to pass the time

Schooling in Fra

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How English speaking children cope with schooling in France is a frequent discussion amongst the foreigners living here. This shouldn’t be a surprise; schooling is often a hot topic in your home country, so wondering how your children will cope with the alien environment of a French school can be doubly stressful! Choosing which school to send your kids to is not so much of an issue, (in most of the areas we deal with there is just one school to choose from) it’s how your children can get the most from that one school that needs attention.

This is my opinion, it is based on fact (I have three children aged 8, 10 and 12 years), but it should probably not be quoted as gospel. I do seem to have to express it quite frequently though so I thought I’d publish it.

My kids have had the (massive) advantage of being born in France. In addition to this, and unusually, we took the decision to send them to a French childminder from age 1 until school started. (This facility is heavily subsidised and in our area was organised by the local ‘Relais des Assistantes Maternelles’ or RAM). This meant that my kids pretty much learnt the two languages together. BUT both my wife and I speak only English at home and, although we have both French and UK television we tend to gravitate towards the UK TV 95% of the time.

I’m not saying this to brag, just to give you an idea of how they are doing, they are average in the class for French, in most other subjects they are slightly above average. In the primary schools many English speaking children manage to follow the curriculum without too much difficulty. However if the basics of the language aren’t mastered by the time they start collège (secondary school) at the age of 11 it can become quite an issue. We’ve done some analysis and I think some (more) of the reasons our kids cope quite well are:

* We enrolled them in as many French run clubs and holiday activities etc. as we could. Here the kids are exposed to more ‘conversational’ French than in the school environment.

* My wife is a full-time Mum and speaks good French (mostly self-taught) so can help with their homework.

* We have a tutor who comes to the house once a week to fill in the gaps.

Even with these ‘extras’ the kids just about keep their heads above water on the schooling front. You shouldn’t expect much extra help from the schools either. Some do run remedial lessons for non-French speakers but only for an hour or so per week, and there is normally no classroom assistant to help them on a daily basis. Quite often any difficulties that your child might have will just be put down to the fact that they are not a native French speaker.

In fact I was talking about this yesterday with someone from Samoëns and another from Chamonix. Apparently can get a bit frosty on occasion in the Chamonix schools, they have had to deal with too many non-French speakers and it sounds like they are getting fed up now (this wasn’t reported in Samoëns). Of particular ire was the scene of an English parent picking their kids up from school whilst dressed in ski kit. You can imagine what the teachers think. There isn’t the same hostility where I live in St Jean d’Aulps, but the proportion of English speaking children in the three primary school classes is 25%, 30% and in one class 50%! You can perhaps understand a little why the French can feel put out.

So you’ve got a couple of options to think about. Either “go native” and find somewhere “French”, or to head for somewhere like the Annecy area that caters for the bi-lingual aspect of your childs education.

Go Native

So to try and avoid other English speaking kids at school. We have witnessed many new English speakers starting school who cling on to a small group of Anglophones in the class. It’s not exactly the language “immersion” many parents imagine before coming here. It slows progress significantly. Stay on top of the situation too; it’s hard work but if the first time you discover you child is struggling at school is in their end of term report you may well have a lot of ground to cover to sort the situation out.

With this in mind here are some suggestions for the predominantly French areas in the Haute Savoie.

Le Petit Bornand and Thones in the Aravis: http://www.alpine-property.com/area/5/aravis

Espace Diamant: http://www.alpine-property.com/area/8/espace-diamant

Vallee Verte: http://www.alpine-property.com/area/9/vallee-verte

Possibly Samoëns but in fact, on this subject, I think you will be better off further down the valley in Taninings or Mieussy.

The Annecy Options

It could be Annecy’s proximity to Geneva but there are now several options available to relocated families with bilingual kindergarten and primary schools such as Ecole Bilingue de Haute-Savoie in Annecy and the Mésanges Ecole Bilingue Montessori in Veigy. French secondary schools in the area are also starting to offer specialised classes for native English speakers and gifted French kids, seeing the benefits of having native English speakers in the school.

These developments will no doubt help families avoid having to needlessly move back to the UK for educational reasons when their children can profit from diverse, high quality schooling in situ – and still go skiing!

You can read more about the Lake Annecy area here: http://www.alpine-property.com/area/10/lac-annecy or see a list of the properties we have for sale around the lake here: http://www.alpine-property.com/lacannecy

The bottom line is – schooling cannot be left to chance; which in fact is the same everywhere!

Alpine Property in the press, winter 13/14

Selling your property in the Alps

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So, your life is moving into a new phase, or the family no longer want to spend Christmas together in the chalet, or the time has come to spend some of the cash tied up in your property. The decision to sell your ski chalet can have any number of triggers, but whatever the reason, let’s assume you have reluctantly decided to put your much-loved ski property on the market. Hopefully with us at Alpine Property.

Maison des Billets, Samoens, for sale for 600,000€ in February 2014.

Selling your chalet in the Alps is one of those things most people do just once in a lifetime. Unfortunately, it’s also one of those things where practise makes perfect. So, what are the dos and don’ts of putting your property on the market in France?

Most important of all…………..

DO price the property realistically. First talk to us! We would say that wouldn’t we? It is tempting to take a look at similar properties for sale with Alpine Property (or other agencies!) to gauge current asking prices, then decide on a price for your property yourself. This comes with risks. For example there are a number of properties on our books that have been there a while and it could be that they are not realistically priced. The second home market is different from other markets, the properties are regarded as “assets” by the owners and often they’d like to sell but they don’t NEED to sell. So if the property is overpriced they are happy to sit and wait. We base our valuations on actual sales figures including data from the notaires, which therefore reflect a more accurate market price.

Talk to us so we can work together on a price that will represent good value relative to the other properties. This way you will almost invariably achieve a higher selling price. Let me explain. Properties which are priced realistically sell very quickly and often a deal is struck within a month. Properties which are priced too highly only sell after sitting for a long time on the market and undergoing a series of painful price reductions. The reason for this is that buyers watch websites like ours at Alpine Property constantly and are surprisingly clever at identifying properties which have been for sale for some time. These properties are perceived to have something wrong with them and are unattractive to a buyer. Buyers, like early birds seeking a juicy worm, are instinctively drawn to properties which are new on the market. Thus there is a brief window of opportunity to get the best price for your property when it first goes on the market. Price the property too highly and that opportunity is lost.

Our agents are experienced in the prices actually being achieved in the market and will be very happy to advise you on a realistic price. Take a look at our Sell Property page for more practical advice

DO NOT Listen to an agent who suggests testing the market with a price at the top end of the price range you had in mind. His strategy is to get your property onto his books first and worry about selling it later. He will no doubt come back to you in three months time and suggest a substantial price reduction. By this time your property will be stale.

DO make every effort to help us present the property well. The property photographs we take are obviously vital. We use the best equipment to produce good quality views, but it’s up to you to ensure the chalet is clean and tidy. Homestaging is well worth the time and effort. We work with several people in the area that can help with this. The same applies when we make visits. Buyers will only buy an untidy or dirty chalet if it is being sold at a substantial discount. I’ll write another post on the best way to present your property for sale.

DO put yourself in the shoes of a buyer. Often a client looking to buy a chalet within a certain price range has seen many properties priced similarly and has an instant idea of what is reasonable and what isn’t. Though we advise caution on advertised prices not always being an accurate reflection of true value, it can be an eye opener to go ‘internet shopping’ and seeing if you can find a better property than yours for the same money. If you do, then you can be sure that these properties will sell first and yours will remain on the market.

DO keep in touch with your Alpine Property agent. We monitor all our virtual visits of your property listing, log all enquiries from our buyers and are happy to provide feedback at anytime, including after visits. If you’re not getting any buyers looking at the property, then we’ll probably have an idea as to why, and can advise you accordingly. This is the case with any other agency you are using too, particularly if they have given you a high valuation. Once again, it is all well and good them saying your chalet is worth X, but it is then reasonable to challenge them as to why it is not getting any interest.

DO make sure that you are clear as to your Capital Gains Tax liability. The tax situation for second homes has recently seen some flux in France so a visit to a local accountant or Notaire is a must if you are not sure where you stand. Meilleurs Agents can be a good place to get the CGT table for France. Don’t believe everything you read on the web though!

Build your own chalet

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This was written in 2014, the numbers are out of date! I have refreshed it in a post late 2019. We frequently get asked how much it will cost to build your own chalet. In general we quote 2500€/m2 as a benchmark. Sometimes we qualify this with “of course it depends on many many, factors”, such as the floor area, quality of materials and fixtures and fittings, easy of building on the site, proximity of services and things like that. But in the end 2500€/m2 is a good place to start. So if you were building a 4 bedroom 140m2 chalet then a starting point would be 350,000 € to build the chalet after you have bought the land.

When I mention these figures to UK-based buyers that know about these things they take a sharp intake of breath. Apparently you can build houses in the UK for much less than that. Closer to 1500€/m2 I’m told and sometimes even less. So why the big difference? Some of my opinions follow:

Everything costs more in the Alps. In particular materials and more importantly labour.
We are not comparing like with like. The “average” chalet in the Alps is higher quality than a cheap house in the UK.
The build methods in the Alps are more expensive. In general the properties have concrete basements and first floors. This makes a very solid property, sometimes due to earthquake and avalanche risks it’s mandatory to build this way. It’s also just “the way it’s done”, much like in the UK houses have traditionally been built from brick.

There are various things you can do to reduce these costs. Taking each point one by one.

I’m not going to suggest importing your materials from afar or even you labour (though both these things are possible and may save money).
Building a cheap quality chalet is not a good idea, it would be a real shame to waste the worlds resources on building a house that won’t last.
Build methods, there could be money saved here. It may also bring in points one and two. I’m referring to kit chalets.

My neighbour is a carpenter and he has just built a chalet using mostly traditional techniques. The basement is concrete as are some of the first floor walls. The main frame was a kit though, the walls arrived on a lorry and ready built. He’s obviously building on a budget but doesn’t want to live in a cardboard box. His build costs will be well under 2000€/m2.

kit chalet in Samoens

We’ve recently been approached by a ECSUS Design, who have recently completed a chalet in Samoens and are constructing a couple more in Morzine this summer. These guys either design your home or adapt an existing design and fabricate using Structurally Insulated Panels (SIPs) that are precision engineered and cut to size to ensure an exceptionally quick method of building a highly thermally efficient chalet. The main weather-tight structure can be erected in as little as 3-4 weeks and can be easily finished by an adventurous self builder or they can do the entire job for you. The average costs of the SIPS structure is about 450€/m2 which represents about 30% of the overall costs of a new chalet and means that a fully managed build can come in at under 2000€/m2. Now I can’t act as a reference for these guys but they can offer references if interested. The company is http://www.ecsusdesign.com/ and the SIPs system is http://www.tek.kingspan.com/ They supplied me with the lovely photo of the finished chalet in Samoens. I have used it to illustrate this post.

New apartment development in Samoens

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Les Rivières des Montagnes is a new development right next to the Grand Massif Express in Samoens. It’s a prime location that is hard to beat. 250m from the lift and a 5 minute walk from the centre of Samoens . In the summer it’s a great spot too, it’s next to the riverside path and only a short bike ride from the park and municipal swimming pool too.

If you look at the map below you’ll clearly see the ski lift, swimming pool and edge of Samoens village centre. I’ve marked the plot in red too.

There are 17 apartments and a ski shop in the building. Currently there are 13 apartments left to sell (as of February 2014)

We have one studio for sale 3 x 1 bedroom apartments, 3 x 2 bedroom apartments, 7 larger 2 bedroom apartments, one 3 bedroom and one 4 bedroom. I have listed them below.

#Apt 14 – studio
#Apt 4,6,9 – all 1 bedroom (#4 is SOLD)
#Apt 2,7,12 – 2 bedrooms (#7 is SOLD)
#Apt 3,5,8,10,11 – 2 bedrooms+study (#3 and #8 is SOLD)
Apt 13 – 2 bedrooms+study+store
Apt 15 – 2 bedrooms+mezz+study
#Apt 16 – 3 bedrooms + study
#Apt 17 – 4 bedrooms

#On our website

Appt. Rivières des Montagnes, 2
http://www.alpine-property.com/index.php?page=prop_1_rivieresmontagnes2

Appt 5:
http://www.alpine-property.com/index.php?page=prop_1_rivieresmontagnes3

Appt. Rivières des Montagnes, 6
http://www.alpine-property.com/index.php?page=prop_1_rivieresmontagnes4

Appt 13:
http://www.alpine-property.com/index.php?page=prop_1_rivieresmontagnes13

Appt 14
http://www.alpine-property.com/index.php?page=prop_1_rivieresmontagnes14

Appt. Rivières des Montagnes, 16
http://www.alpine-property.com/index.php?page=prop_1_rivieresmontagnes16

Appt 17:
http://www.alpine-property.com/index.php?page=prop_1_rivieresmontagnes17

The price list is available here:

Price list only

The new apartments are due to be completed by early summer 2015. That might sound like some way in the future but it’s not. Construction has just started. There will have to be a break for winter. It will restart again in the Spring of 2014, then the major works will have to be completed by the end of 2014, when you think that there are 17 apartments and a ski shop to build that’s a big job! The building will need to be watertight by the Christmas 2014 so the internal finishing can take place over the following winter for completion at the end of Spring 2015.

Here is a picture of the works up to date (Dec 2013)

and the advertising sign erected on the site.

Giving your chalet a makeover

The final stages of finishing off a renovation are often overlooked, the furnishing and decorating of the newly renovated apartment or chalet is often left to the owners to undertake – a daunting enough task close to home! Many of the renovation projects managed by members of the Alpine Property team are finished off by professionals, you’d imagine that this would increase the cost even more, it doesn’t have to. Especially if you take into account the amount of time you would need to finish the job. Time better spent enjoying the finished product!

Liz Ockelton – MAKE SPACE DESIGNS (www.makespacedesigns.com) has completed a number of projects for Alpine Property. Here are some of the results.

1. Chalet Robri in Morzine. Situated in out of the most sought after locations in Morzine and well worth going to some effort to present in the best possible light.

1. Chalet La Roche SAMOENS – sold by Denis Barbier of Alpine Property renovations completed by MSD adding an extra bedroom and now 4 new bathrooms. The original property listing is here. A selection of photos of the updated chalet are below.

2. La Christiana MORZINE – sold by Lee Massey of Alpine Property though before it ended up on the website. Newly furnished by MSD.

3. This BONNEVAUX farm, sold by Claudia and Ed. Chalet Bonnevaux. The original listing is here, this old farm was habitable but it has now been renovated. Below are some images of the construction and renovation work.

The Alpine Property Blog

Selling properties in the Alps since 1999